lifespan of revival

this is a post i mad on a forum for of a friend after a short conversation i had with him... maybe it is something you would care to chime in on... here's the link for the forum post: http://theos.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=63&t=3431

Now, if I understand Steve’s position correctly and please correct me if I’m wrong, he feels that revival must end because if we were in a constant state of revival there would be no need for faith or perhaps not as much of an opportunity for faith as there is when there is no revival going on. Now this has to happen every generation or so to give the church a sort of spiritual shot in the arm to give us some life again but then after a while the fervor must die down so that our faith is not in the enthusiasm or miraculous things that come with revival but in God Himself. This has been shown to be true not from the scriptures but from revival history and the conclusions which are drawn from what even a simple study of church history would cause us to deduce.

I feel we should lean less on experience and more on the promises we find in scripture for the standard we should expect out the Christian life:

2 Corinthians 3:18 But we all, with unveiled face, beholding as in a mirror the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory, just as from the Lord, the Spirit.

Isaiah 9:7 There will be no end to the increase of His government or of peace, on the throne of David and over his kingdom, To establish it and to uphold it with justice and righteousness from then on and forevermore the zeal of the LORD of hosts will accomplish this.

Daniel 2:35 Then the iron, the clay, the bronze, the silver and the gold were broken to pieces at the same time and became like chaff on a threshing floor in the summer. The wind swept them away without leaving a trace. But the rock that struck the statue became a huge mountain and filled the whole earth.

Notice these all show constant growth not growth and death and growth or growth, stagnation, growth.

On the personal side of things what does the Bible say is the destiny of the believer? Is it to be revival then discipline?

Rom8:29 For those whom He foreknew, He also predestined to become conformed to the image of His Son, so that He would be the firstborn among many brethren

So the Bible says that we are to be made like Christ… having read about His life once or twice I can’t say I can find a time when He was not bringing revival with Him. If that is therefore not what we are seeing in our lives maybe we are not living up to the standard of scripture but instead being conformed to this world...

This then begs the question; why do we not see revivals last beyond the first generation? I think in order to answer that we have to look more to who we are than who God is. We find it east to trust in God in times of lack and times of trouble but we soon forget God in times of blessing and abundance. Paul said “Not that I speak from want, for I have learned to be content in whatever circumstances I am.

I know how to get along with humble means, and I also know how to live in prosperity; in any and every circumstance I have learned the secret of being filled and going hungry, both of having abundance and suffering need. I can do all things through Him who strengthens me.” (Philippians 4:11-13) and because of his reliance on Christ in both “humble means” and “prosperity” Paul too was blessed with revival all the days of his life.

I think the most obvious example of revival and destruction from revival would have to be that of David and Solomon. Solomon, came into great abundance and blessing from what his father David had done in his life and in spite of being blessed with wisdom beyond any other he became enthralled with His blessings. This caused not only the end of the revival but the splitting of the kingdom and countless forms of occult being brought in to Israel. Solomon abandoned God and trusted in himself and his wisdom for the prosperity of his kingdom and the glory God had given it faded just as the revivals in history have after people begin to follow the structure and tradition instead of the God those who began the revival followed.

Now obviously this is way oversimplified but maybe something to get some gears spinning and perhaps start a few conversations about it and what we can do to see another move of God here and now!!!

Mark 1:15 "The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent and believe in the gospel."

John and Nic

Ok so I‘ve decided to go ahead and do a little write-up on the time Jesus spent with Nicodemus and contrast that with the teachings of John the Baptist because Jesus, while speaking with Nic, made it clear that being “born again” was the first requirement to seeing the kingdom of God.

He tried to explain that it is not merely the Jesus had to make it clear that being born of flesh is not enough to be called a child of God. Even if you are a descendant of Abraham which Nic was. Physical birth does not equate to a spiritual birth. You are still spiritually dead until you are born of the Sprit. Nic couldn't understand what Jesus was tying to tell him even though Nic was a “teacher of Israel.” Jesus then made it clear that “we speak of what we know” and Nic couldn't understand because although he had theological training, had no genuine experience with the Spirit or heaven. Jesus then goes on to explain where He had received His authority to teach (John 3:13 No one has ever gone into heaven except the one who came from heaven—the Son of Man.) Think about it, in order to ascend you must first descend so Jesus just told Nic that not only was He from heaven but He had also gone back up to heaven since coming down! On a side note; that was essentially an open invitation to go to heaven while we are still here on earth!!!

Now lets contrast that with the teachings of John the Baptist: when his ministry was waning he maid it clear that “a man can receive nothing, except it be given him from heaven.” This already shows John's wisdom and understanding of the kingdom above and beyond what is naturally discerned. He had no desire to build his own ministry only to fulfill his calling. He then goes on to share the truths which answered the questions Jesus was attempting to lead Nic too.

John 3:31-36 "He who comes from above is above all, he who is of the earth is from the earth and speaks of the earth He who comes from heaven is above all. What He has seen and heard, of that He testifies; and no one receives His testimony. He who has received His testimony has set his seal to this, that God is true. For He whom God has sent speaks the words of God; for He gives the Spirit without measure. The Father loves the Son and has given all things into His hand. He who believes in the Son has eternal life; but he who does not obey the Son will not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him."

It's a beautiful picture the author John paints for us denoting the difference and importance of the proper source for our learning and that all the book learning in the world is worthless without the aid of the Spirit of God. More important than that however is that Christ who is from heaven is “above all” and that He “gives the Spirit without measure!!!!” read over it one more time and chew on it cause it's soooo good. Focus on all the times he says “all” and the message John istrying to get across. If jesus is above all then that means there is nothing He is not above! Duh, but how often do we live as though this is not the case.

P.S. He gives the Spirit without measure!!!!

kingdom's entrance

Mark 1:4,5 John the Baptist appeared in the wilderness preaching a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins. And all the country of Judea was going out to him, and all the people of Jerusalem; and they were being baptized by him in the Jordan River, confessing their sins.

v.9 In those days Jesus came from Nazareth in Galilee and was baptized by John in the Jordan .

v.14,15 Now after John had been taken into custody, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of God, and saying, “The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent and believe in the gospel."

Just a couple of things I need to point out:

1. If we desire to enter into the kingdom we must do it the same way everyone has from the time of John’s proclamation of the coming kingdom to the time Jesus said it was here; repentance.

This isn’t just me saying, “oh God I’m sorry I was wrong please forgive me. ” It is a complete renunciation of my old way of life and submission to the reign of the King. John makes this very clear when he tells the Pharisees “Produce fruit in keeping with repentance. And do not think you can say to yourselves, 'We have Abraham as our father.' I tell you that out of these stones God can raise up children for Abraham.” (Matt 3:8,9)

If we do not produce this “fruit” we have good reason to doubt the validity of our religious experience. Even Jesus came into the kingdom through this “baptism.” If even Jesus had to enter in this way what makes us think we can do it any other way?

After Jesus' baptism He Began to preach; not about salvation as we so often do today but about the arrival of the kingdom. This was the good news or “gospel” which Jesus taught! This was the message of Jesus and the early church. I'm sure a greater knowledge of revival history would show that it was also the message which was brought to truly change the lives and impact the world around the saints.

Good Gospel

In order to see our prayers answered we must pray with faith. in order to pray with faith we need a foundation for that faith; a promise of God or an understanding that what we are praying for is in His will. This is were most of us stumble. So in thinking about and discussing some of the promises of God and what we can expect as children of the king I've come to understand that many people either don’t understand or limit the goodness of God. We think in our minds that what the gospel actually says is too good to be true so we push it out to the future or to heaven not ever expecting that God love us and desires the best for us now and not just in heaven. The fact of the mater is that most of what Christ preached about was the Kingdom and the message of the Gospel is not merely about salvation from hell or even being “born again.” The point of the gospel was that God desires to bring heaven to earth. Go back and re-read The Lords Prayer or recite it to yourself and think as you do, “what if Christ was serious and wanted us to treat this as a literal prayer we were honestly to expect God to answer?”

Over the next few weeks I will be going through the teachings of Christ in the Gospels in an attempt to show just how good these promises are.